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Author Topic: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?  (Read 6372 times)

Offline NYC Peromyscus

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #45 on: December 21, 2017, 08:39:34 AM »
Quote from: ljr on December 20, 2017, 10:42:03 PM
Oh yes--if you don't like it, move! JH is perfect just as it is--maybe YOU don't belong here. What a lovely sentiment. So helpful. This thread was started by Addictive, the new tapas and wine bar--a beautiful example of the sort of (oh the horror of it!) "upscale" or "gentrified" offering that is enhancing the neighborhood and attracting all sorts of customers, from all sorts of backgrounds. All some of us want is more of the same. What is so terrible, so threatening about a broader array of retail offerings in JH? How does it hurt the neighborhood? I see a lot of empty storefronts. I don't think the new stores are actually displacing anyone, but rather adding options and life to JH.

I just feel bad for people that seem to be suffering from the lack of "upscale" options in JH, and see a bistro or nice gym as the way out of their suffering. Why live some place you don't like that much? JH is going to change at a glacial pace...few of the things on this list are likely to happen in the next 5-10 years if at all.
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Offline N00b

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #46 on: December 21, 2017, 09:06:40 AM »
Falafel is fried but ok. Most cuisines offer healthy options.

Plenty of people travel all the time for things they *need* and don't feel entitled to have it in their immediate neighborhood. and if it's that important to have a juice press down the block why did you choose JH. 
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Offline jeanette

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #47 on: December 21, 2017, 09:57:32 AM »
[quote author=NYC Peromyscus link=topic=17369.msg83063#msg83063
I just feel bad for people that seem to be suffering from the lack of "upscale" options in JH, and see a bistro or nice gym as the way out of their suffering. Why live some place you don't like that much? JH is going to change at a glacial pace...few of the things on this list are likely to happen in the next 5-10 years if at all.
[/quote]

NYCPero': Perhaps you are responding to ljr's use of the word upscale, but I am pretty sure falafel, pizza, cucumbers, cream cheese, and English tea are not upscale foods.

Upper JH is saturated with rice and beans. Lower JH, rice and spice. Roosevelt for instance is tacos from say 70th to its crossing Northern.

What we are seeing are what entrepreneurs are comfortable selling. Don't underestimate or overgeneralize Hispanic tastes or desires. Yes, they do enjoy comfort foods from home, yet when I was shopping with my friend we had to go out of our way so that she could by matzo flour. She is from Argentina and barely speaks English; her husband is the same, and Jewish. Even without asking, I'm positive she would love to have a Jewish deli near her home...to pick up a matzo ball soup for him and make her life a little bit easier.

What happened to diversity?
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Offline ljr

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #48 on: December 21, 2017, 10:14:21 AM »
I referred to "upscale" because these wishes are often characterized that way--as the things that more affluent people want. I don't think juice bars are especially upscale, and in fact we do have them here and they are popular with people from all walks of life, I observe, not just what used to be called "yuppies." I disagree with the commenter who says all cuisines have healthy options. Some are very much not healthy for people who need to avoid certain ingredients. I have sometimes asked for "no spice" or "very little spice" and gotten a very spicy dish. This probably goes under the same heading as the commenters who are saying "If you don't like what we have in JH, don't live here," ie, "If you don't want spicy food, don't eat here at Thakali Kitchen." Hence, the issue I have with the lack of options.
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Offline jeanette

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #49 on: December 21, 2017, 10:15:09 AM »
Cafe Bene is a bistro. Not ethnic at all. It seems to be popular. I've even seen it packed. The customers appear to be mostly foreign born. The cashier I dealt with barely spoke English. It's a nice addition to the neighborhood.

There's always a line at Cannelle. Very diverse clientele.

Lots of Hispanics shop at Downtown Natural Market. I know because I shop there.

N00b, you're conflating two different posters. I eat fried foods. I am the one that eats falafel.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2017, 10:21:14 AM by jeanette »
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Offline ljr

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #50 on: December 21, 2017, 12:02:08 PM »
I second everything that Jeanette says so well. And that is the only point I am making: there is no reason why we cannot have more diversity in our retail offerings, and I just don't believe the people who say what is here and already successful here is the only thing that can be successful here, "the market has spoken," etc. It's a lot more complicated than the notion that we get what we want or deserve or are entitled to because of the laws of the market, or supply and demand. I second the observation that places like Cannelle and Downtown Market—which might be considered by the naysayers here as unwelcome, non-JH-type businesses—are very successful and popular with customers of all nationalities.
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Offline BennyB

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #51 on: December 21, 2017, 04:28:53 PM »
Cannelle is a great option. And there is a Greek restaurant and also a large pizzeria next door. But not sure if everyone would consider these in the neighborhood...
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Offline PizzaRat

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #52 on: December 22, 2017, 10:55:53 AM »
Quote from: Shelby2 on December 18, 2017, 08:45:16 PM
Quote from: PizzaRat on December 18, 2017, 05:57:27 PM
A bookstore will always be my #1 wish-list item for Jackson Heights (if we don't get one soon I'd like to open one someday).

Definitely more cafes—the only real "hangout" cafe near me is Espresso 77, which is a good example of what we need more of.

More healthy options. I'm so excited about Fresh Spilt Milk (not even gonna try to write the name out correctly).

I know we hate chains but a Whole Foods or more upscale market (like the ones they have in LIC) would be kinda great. I generally hate shopping at the only two supermarkets close to me, Foodtown and the other one across the street (Food Bazaar?).

An actual cool bar would be great! Yes, I know and love Terraza, but it's like a 15-20 minute walk away and sometimes you just want to walk a few blocks and hang out without it being a whole thing.

I do shop at Whole Foods sometimes and would love to have one in walking distance. I'm not so sure about wanting one of the upscale markets you're talking about in LIC, though. If we're thinking of the same place (Food Cellar), it's kind of a Whole Foods wannabe but the prices seem really outrageous and there's no Whole365 brand to offset them.

I do think that a health food store that had better prepared food options would be great here. The few organic stores I've been to in Astoria do manage to have that, so it's certainly possible.

I know what you mean. I would prefer to at least have the option of something like Food Cellar, but it definitely couldn't be the main supermarket because the prices are too high. The Natural Food Market is a good option for this kind of shopping, but I find it too far to lug groceries all the way home from there to my place.
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Offline theplanesland

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #53 on: December 22, 2017, 11:12:39 AM »
I'm like ... 25% trolling here, admittedly, but there's another underlying issue I want to bring up.

In 100% of the cases so far, these kinds of businesses have been bellwethers for massively higher residential rents and driving out working-class immigrant residents. I lived through the beginning of the process in Astoria. And I came to Jackson Heights in part because I wanted to be in a neighborhood with a lot of income and ethnic diversity. So I think the resistance, from a lot of us, comes from that relentless history of "the wine bar shows up, and a few years later you wake up and everything's wine bars," like we've seen on 30th Avenue in Astoria. Wine bars, or Whole Foodses, seem to be like Pringles - if you open the can, nobody can stop at just one.
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Offline jeanette

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #54 on: December 22, 2017, 12:12:11 PM »
Your right, you're trolling.

Landlords will raise rents anywhere, everywhere, as long as they can get away with it. If you really want to keep rents down, why not advocate for homeless shelters, halfway houses, and SROs. For sure you will keep the rents down that way.

I'm just trolling, you know.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2017, 12:18:10 PM by jeanette »
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Offline Dodger

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #55 on: December 22, 2017, 03:18:29 PM »
I'd raise Sunnyside for the sake of comparison, rather than Astoria which is the one always raised. The rents in Sunnyside are only a little higher than in Jackson Heights (which is probably due to the closer to Manhattan location) and are a good bit lower than Astoria. (For instance, if you search 1 bedrooms in Sunnyside, Jackson Heights and Astoria on Streeteasy and sort by most expensive, the first three pages are all Astoria.)  And I think coop sales prices are a good bit higher in Jackson Heights than Sunnyside.

But Sunnyside has a small collection of wine bars, Neapolitan pizza, gastropubs (and the thing I pine for most -- Parrot Coffee). Perhaps we are just in the bellwether phase there, but I wouldn't be so sure. I don't think there is a single process "gentrification" that operates as a tidal wave everywhere once you let the first drip drip drip in. There are multiple dynamics and actors involved. To me Sunnyside feels like it's achieved a stable balance of different kinds of businesses along with income and ethnocultural diversity.  And I'd like to see Jackson Heights move a little in the Sunnyside direction.

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Offline jeanette

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Re: New Year is approaching...What do you want to see opening comes 2018?
« Reply #56 on: December 22, 2017, 05:04:42 PM »
Regarding the charge that wide-appeal retail (bistros and wine bars) drives up rents, can someone explain why a studio on 88th Street would cost $850/mo, and ten years later $1500/mo (I'm estimating, basing this on r/e ads), when nothing of that sort has opened. Meanwhile, the area is and has been completely saturated with ethnic stores and restaurants. 

Rising housing costs cannot be honestly linked to wide-appeal* retail in the vicinity.

*Parrot sells Black Sea products and is technically ethnic.
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