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Should the 2020 Census include a question about citizenship?

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Offline JK resident

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Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« on: March 29, 2018, 07:08:00 PM »
There has been much discussion if the 2020 census should include a citizenship question. Please vote
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Offline Alfster

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2018, 08:44:07 PM »
Quote from: JK resident on March 29, 2018, 07:08:00 PM
There has been much discussion if the 2020 census should include a citizenship question. Please vote

Personally, I think that the next Census should ask this question.  It's an important piece of data to know in order to properly enumerate the population and their residency status (ie. Citizen, legal resident, non legal resident).  However, I can imagine that illegals may choose to lie when answering this question.
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Offline lalochezia

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2018, 09:31:15 PM »
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Offline Alfster

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2018, 11:07:24 PM »
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Offline CaptainFlannel

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2018, 07:13:32 AM »
Quote
It's an important piece of data to know in order to properly enumerate the population and their residency status (ie. Citizen, legal resident, non legal resident)

The constitution doesn't not state that the census is to enumerate legal status. It states that it is done every 10 years to determine how many people live in the U.S. (And the original text, before the 14th Amendment, qualified African Americans as 3/5 of a person).

It's important to understand that this is tied directly to Congressional districting and representation in Congress (as well as how federal dollars are allocated). Last census, the population in Queens supposedly shrank, which we know is nonsense. It's hard enough to get undocumented people to respond -- they don't trust that this information is not being shared with immigration officials. Add a question about citizenship, and you only make it that much less likely to get a true count.

I'm curious what will happen if citizens refuse to answer that question if it is included (which would be my inclination). Will the Census send out workers to attempt to complete the questionnaire? How many times will they come calling?
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Offline Lilybell

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2018, 08:56:03 AM »
It's already difficult enough to get undocumented residents to fill out the census. This will make it next to impossible to get an accurate count.
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Offline petster

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2018, 08:57:29 AM »
Curious to know.  Does the census ask about income, gender and race?  I don't remember.  If it's about numbers then none of these questions need to be asked.  If it's about demographics then that's a different story.
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Offline CaptainFlannel

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2018, 10:05:17 AM »
Last one asked about race and ethnicity (Latino). Not income. Looks like it will be the same this time. (I think in the past income has been a question).

https://www.npr.org/2018/01/26/580865378/census-request-suggests-no-race-ethnicity-data-changes-in-2020-experts-say

Race was a tough one for some folks when I was a census worker, and reflects how race is truly a fluid social construct. I talked to a whole lot of people who didn't relate to any of the racial categories included on the form, and it's not a census worker's place to tell someone how they should self-identify if they want to fill in the "other" category.
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Offline N00b

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2018, 12:37:30 PM »
Quote from: Alfster on March 29, 2018, 08:44:07 PM
Quote from: JK resident on March 29, 2018, 07:08:00 PM
There has been much discussion if the 2020 census should include a citizenship question. Please vote

Personally, I think that the next Census should ask this question.  It's an important piece of data to know in order to properly enumerate the population and their residency status (ie. Citizen, legal resident, non legal resident).  However, I can imagine that illegals may choose to lie when answering this question.

Curious what purpose you think identifying legal status would serve in the overall census
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Offline JK resident

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2018, 05:14:39 PM »
The federal government could allocate dollars to areas with few citizens to teach them English and help them pass the test to become a citizen. This is one example. Critics will claim that it could be used to direct ICE agents.
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Offline N00b

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #10 on: March 31, 2018, 10:36:09 AM »
Quote from: JK resident on March 30, 2018, 05:14:39 PM
The federal government could allocate dollars to areas with few citizens to teach them English and help them pass the test to become a citizen. This is one example. Critics will claim that it could be used to direct ICE agents.

This assumes everyone wants to become a citizen. This assumes non-citizens don't speak English or want to learn. I wonder why you have these assumptions and what the implication is. Plenty of permanent residents live here without ever becoming citizens - that is also 100% legal. Plenty of other people live here on legal statuses other than citizenship. There are also many people here without legal status for whom there is no path to citizenship even if they speak fluent English and know more civics than the average native born American because the federal government has made it crystal clear that they don't want to create a path - not even for DREAMERS, much less "illegal" immigrants who came here as adults. That possible proposal you posited is a reach at bestttttttt but more likely, just dishonest pretext. I encourage you to be less ignorant.

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Offline JK resident

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2018, 11:56:32 AM »
That is not my argument for that position only a possible reason the government could give for asking citizenship status. You seem to be arguing with a wall all by yourself. If you reread my post slowly you may be able to comprehend that I wrote both sides of possible arguments. 
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Offline CaptainFlannel

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #12 on: March 31, 2018, 12:30:00 PM »
The federal government could allocate dollars to areas with few citizens to teach them English and help them pass the test to become a citizen.

Sure, that sounds totally plausible with the current administration. </sarcasm>
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Offline Alfster

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2018, 06:22:10 PM »
Quote from: N00b on March 31, 2018, 10:36:09 AM
Quote from: JK resident on March 30, 2018, 05:14:39 PM
The federal government could allocate dollars to areas with few citizens to teach them English and help them pass the test to become a citizen. This is one example. Critics will claim that it could be used to direct ICE agents.

This assumes everyone wants to become a citizen. This assumes non-citizens don't speak English or want to learn. I wonder why you have these assumptions and what the implication is. Plenty of permanent residents live here without ever becoming citizens - that is also 100% legal. Plenty of other people live here on legal statuses other than citizenship. There are also many people here without legal status for whom there is no path to citizenship even if they speak fluent English and know more civics than the average native born American because the federal government has made it crystal clear that they don't want to create a path - not even for DREAMERS, much less "illegal" immigrants who came here as adults. That possible proposal you posited is a reach at bestttttttt but more likely, just dishonest pretext. I encourage you to be less ignorant.

Perhaps not all non-residents want to become citizens, but it would be worthwhile to have government programs in place to help those who do.  This would include English courses, civics courses, and perhaps job training programs.  This seems reasonable to me.
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Offline dssjh

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Re: Should the 2020 US Census ask about citizenship?
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2018, 09:28:59 PM »
we already have those things in place.
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