Author Topic: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?  (Read 31249 times)

Offline abcdefghijk

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 1702
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #60 on: November 14, 2018, 11:54:35 AM »
I wonder how this will affect the artists community. I know several in JH who have studios in LIC. In fact, I imagine that many or even most artists in these parts of Queens who rent outside studios do so in LIC, since that's where there has traditionally been availability.

Excited for Amazon’s Arrival in Long Island City? The Results for New York’s Art Community Won’t Be Pretty

Btw, the LIC open studios are this weekend (Nov 17-18, 2018)

Yes...as LIC morphs into a tech version of Williamsburg, I would say the artists' time in LIC has come to an end. 

My guess is that the warehouses in the industrial area around Northern Woodside will become artists' new homes. That's my prediction!

I always wondered why some of the buildings in industrial Woodside didn't get converted into artist studios. Some of the area is extremely close to the train, for instance, the R train at Northern Blvd. I suppose one reason is that artists tend to congregate together and no one was willing to take a chance on developing a building in an outlying area. But the rents for artist studios have already skyrocketed in LIC in the past 3-4 years so it would have made sense to branch out to Woodside, if commercial rents are actually cheaper in Woodside. Maybe the rents are not actually substantially cheaper.

This may be the shake-up needed. Lots of Woodside seems to be semi industrial... Also South Woodside around Queens Bld is industrial. There is  a lot of industrial space there too. It certainly isn't hip however. Feels like kinda New Jersey there.

Offline Lilybell

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 1253
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #61 on: November 14, 2018, 12:34:50 PM »
Quote
I think Amazon might not have a huge impact on NYC overall, but it will definitely have a big impact on the neighborhoods near Long Island City. If other tech companies start moving to NYC (or growing here), e.g. to hire all the dissatisfied Amazon employees who have already moved here, then that could have a big impact on NYC.

For example, there was an article a few days ago that Google is going to double their headcount in NYC (to 20,000+), and Facebook also has a large office here which will probably grow.

This is a great point. I've heard some very early rumblings that Netflix is also considering a large NYC presence.

Offline jeanette

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 1091
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #62 on: November 14, 2018, 12:46:48 PM »
I do not so much think about how I will be affected negatively, but more about my son's future opportunities and others of his generation. For them, this is incredibly great news.

Offline sl

  • Council Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 444
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #63 on: November 14, 2018, 12:52:06 PM »
I guess this is good news for software engineers like me.

Offline dssjh

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 5314
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #64 on: November 14, 2018, 04:18:51 PM »
pretty much across the board, it's good news for the upper middle class and upper class residents of the area. professionals who can (and will) earn six figure salaries and be able to purchase (or rent) luxury housing and enjoy luxury amenities.

for the lower-middle class (or even middle-middle class) residents of the surrounding areas, not so much. a rising tide does NOT lift all boats -- it's not like we're suddenly going to boost the salaries of EMTs, nurses, public school teachers or retail workers by 20 or 30 percent. those folks will remain where they are, and a gulf will open, a greater gulf than the one that already exists.

no, i'm not advocating for a maximum wage/a massive redistribution of wealth, just noting that the inequities will become more and more stark in coming years.


Offline seattlelite

  • Tourist
  • **
  • Posts: 6
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #66 on: November 15, 2018, 09:04:48 AM »
for the lower-middle class (or even middle-middle class) residents of the surrounding areas, not so much. a rising tide does NOT lift all boats -- it's not like we're suddenly going to boost the salaries of EMTs, nurses, public school teachers or retail workers by 20 or 30 percent. those folks will remain where they are, and a gulf will open, a greater gulf than the one that already exists.
Based on what happened in Seattle, Amazon workers tended to spend a lot of money in the community, helping to maintain and create local jobs. Think restaurants, bakeries, hairdressers, cinemas, of course dog daycare centers, etc. They didn't just hoard their money.

And salaries generally did go up in Seattle (and the minimum wage went up, notably). Partly because the Amazon workers could afford to pay higher prices for things, so other employers could afford to raise salaries. And also partly because other employers had to increase their salaries in order to compete with Amazon for employees. Amazon hires a really broad range of people, not just engineers.

Probably one of the worst things that happened in Seattle is that the prices of anything that was very limited in supply went up sharply (e.g. rent and housing prices), which did hurt a lot of people in the community, unless they already owned property themselves. It probably could have been much worse, Seattle was actually pretty good at knocking down old warehouses and buildings and constructing new apartments, which helped to prevent severe price escalation like in San Francisco and the Bay Area (where no new housing seems to ever be constructed). But the house prices still escalated pretty rapidly in Seattle.

BTW, for anyone curious about Amazon work culture, this site is pretty interesting: https://sites.google.com/site/thefaceofamazon/. It has stories about office jobs and also about warehouse jobs.

Offline abcdefghijk

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 1702
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #67 on: November 15, 2018, 09:28:37 AM »
for the lower-middle class (or even middle-middle class) residents of the surrounding areas, not so much. a rising tide does NOT lift all boats -- it's not like we're suddenly going to boost the salaries of EMTs, nurses, public school teachers or retail workers by 20 or 30 percent. those folks will remain where they are, and a gulf will open, a greater gulf than the one that already exists.
Based on what happened in Seattle, Amazon workers tended to spend a lot of money in the community, helping to maintain and create local jobs. Think restaurants, bakeries, hairdressers, cinemas, of course dog daycare centers, etc. They didn't just hoard their money.

And salaries generally did go up in Seattle (and the minimum wage went up, notably). Partly because the Amazon workers could afford to pay higher prices for things, so other employers could afford to raise salaries. And also partly because other employers had to increase their salaries in order to compete with Amazon for employees. Amazon hires a really broad range of people, not just engineers.

Probably one of the worst things that happened in Seattle is that the prices of anything that was very limited in supply went up sharply (e.g. rent and housing prices), which did hurt a lot of people in the community, unless they already owned property themselves. It probably could have been much worse, Seattle was actually pretty good at knocking down old warehouses and buildings and constructing new apartments, which helped to prevent severe price escalation like in San Francisco and the Bay Area (where no new housing seems to ever be constructed). But the house prices still escalated pretty rapidly in Seattle.

BTW, for anyone curious about Amazon work culture, this site is pretty interesting: https://sites.google.com/site/thefaceofamazon/. It has stories about office jobs and also about warehouse jobs.

Thanks for your authentic Amazonian/Seattle insights.

There's a limit to the speculation, clairvoyance, conjecture and hyperbole which abounds on this forum!  :)

Offline dssjh

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 5314
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #68 on: November 15, 2018, 10:34:41 AM »
"There's a limit to the speculation, clairvoyance, conjecture and hyperbole which abounds on this forum"

there doesn't seem to be. on all sides. i've been guilty, you've been guilty. but that's the nature of free wheeling debate.

Offline jeanette

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 1091
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #69 on: November 15, 2018, 06:15:45 PM »
WHOA.

Queens Neighborhoods United
November 13 at 1:31 PM ·
***STATEMENT ON AMAZON TO COME TO QUEENS***
   To make it very clear, Queens Neighborhoods United is entirely against Amazon. We will not negotiate our survival and we’ll do everything in our power to shut them down. Our line is clear, fast and unflinching. We will make it impossible for them. We will target the politicians, the individuals, the institutions, the organizations and whoever else had the power to stop this deal.
   In a city with such wealth, we still have over 65,000 families homeless, NYCHA is 16 billion dollars in debt – its residents and many of our neighbors are living in mold-infested hazardous buildings, experiencing eviction, landlord terrorism, and crumbling infrastructure. We are told by city officials that this is because there are not enough tax revenues to repair these social dilemmas.
   How did the city suddenly come up with a plan to give such significant tax breaks and incentives to a corporation led by the richest man in the world? (Jeff Bezos makes $3,182 every second, according to Time.com)
   They say Amazon will create good jobs, but Amazon has a track record of relying heavily on short-term contract-based jobs without long-term security or benefits. Amazon uses mafia tactics to bully smaller thriving businesses forcing them to submit and sell their ownership status to Amazon (see what happened to diapers.com as an example).
   Amazon is notorious for abusing workers who must work intensive hours to the point where they are forced to pee in bottles to keep up with delivery orders. Jeff Bezos announced a wage increase to $15 an hour, but simultaneously stripped worker’s access to stock options and bonuses, leaving workers worse off.
   Amazon spent millions of dollars to lobby and buy out politicians and non-profits in Seattle to overturn a tax which would have created an affordable housing fund for homeless evicted residents that is desperately needed in that city.
   Most recently, Amazon has colluded with ICE and police departments across the country to create a bug-ridden, racially-biased facial recognition software system that puts our communities in danger. Amazon holds the largest share of governmental contracts to maintain databases about detainees and undocumented people.
   We have to remember that these politicians and these corporate behemoths are afraid of people coming together to fight for community self-determination. They will say Amazon is too powerful to take on, and that we should make concessions, but as we look back to our beloved NYC history those who conceded never make history. New Yorkers did not concede to Robert Moses and his corporate gang to bulldoze NYC communities to build a mega expressway for wealthy suburbanites. 100,000 New Yorkers did not concede to corporations when they successfully fought and protested to establish an 8-hour work day in the 1800s. NYC has always been the city that belonged to the tenants and the workers. We should not look to these crooked politicians because they will wear the resistance band for street credit while behind closed doors negotiate our survival with corporations.
   Instead we are the change we have been waiting for. This is not just a Queens problem, this is a fight for our City, and we need everyone fighting alongside us, disturbing the peace every step of the way, in any way possible. So this is a call to individuals and community groups and anyone that’s interested in fighting against this ain’t-shit-company, share this and join us.
   Pray for the dead, fight like hell for the living. Amazon, it’s on.

Offline abcdefghijk

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 1702
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #70 on: November 15, 2018, 11:26:52 PM »
WHOA.

Queens Neighborhoods United
November 13 at 1:31 PM ·
***STATEMENT ON AMAZON TO COME TO QUEENS***
   To make it very clear, Queens Neighborhoods United is entirely against Amazon. We will not negotiate our survival and we’ll do everything in our power to shut them down. Our line is clear, fast and unflinching. We will make it impossible for them. We will target the politicians, the individuals, the institutions, the organizations and whoever else had the power to stop this deal.
   In a city with such wealth, we still have over 65,000 families homeless, NYCHA is 16 billion dollars in debt – its residents and many of our neighbors are living in mold-infested hazardous buildings, experiencing eviction, landlord terrorism, and crumbling infrastructure. We are told by city officials that this is because there are not enough tax revenues to repair these social dilemmas.
   How did the city suddenly come up with a plan to give such significant tax breaks and incentives to a corporation led by the richest man in the world? (Jeff Bezos makes $3,182 every second, according to Time.com)
   They say Amazon will create good jobs, but Amazon has a track record of relying heavily on short-term contract-based jobs without long-term security or benefits. Amazon uses mafia tactics to bully smaller thriving businesses forcing them to submit and sell their ownership status to Amazon (see what happened to diapers.com as an example).
   Amazon is notorious for abusing workers who must work intensive hours to the point where they are forced to pee in bottles to keep up with delivery orders. Jeff Bezos announced a wage increase to $15 an hour, but simultaneously stripped worker’s access to stock options and bonuses, leaving workers worse off.
   Amazon spent millions of dollars to lobby and buy out politicians and non-profits in Seattle to overturn a tax which would have created an affordable housing fund for homeless evicted residents that is desperately needed in that city.
   Most recently, Amazon has colluded with ICE and police departments across the country to create a bug-ridden, racially-biased facial recognition software system that puts our communities in danger. Amazon holds the largest share of governmental contracts to maintain databases about detainees and undocumented people.
   We have to remember that these politicians and these corporate behemoths are afraid of people coming together to fight for community self-determination. They will say Amazon is too powerful to take on, and that we should make concessions, but as we look back to our beloved NYC history those who conceded never make history. New Yorkers did not concede to Robert Moses and his corporate gang to bulldoze NYC communities to build a mega expressway for wealthy suburbanites. 100,000 New Yorkers did not concede to corporations when they successfully fought and protested to establish an 8-hour work day in the 1800s. NYC has always been the city that belonged to the tenants and the workers. We should not look to these crooked politicians because they will wear the resistance band for street credit while behind closed doors negotiate our survival with corporations.
   Instead we are the change we have been waiting for. This is not just a Queens problem, this is a fight for our City, and we need everyone fighting alongside us, disturbing the peace every step of the way, in any way possible. So this is a call to individuals and community groups and anyone that’s interested in fighting against this ain’t-shit-company, share this and join us.
   Pray for the dead, fight like hell for the living. Amazon, it’s on.

Are these the same folks who said Viva Comida was for gringos?

Offline sl

  • Council Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 444
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #71 on: November 16, 2018, 08:11:57 AM »
Don't use the g-word.

Offline dssjh

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 5314
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #72 on: November 16, 2018, 09:45:32 AM »
but DO use the g-spot.

Offline jeanette

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 1091
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #73 on: November 16, 2018, 10:04:14 AM »
Yes to abc, and according to Shelby2, QNU also opposed Target.

Other groups that fall under the same umbrella are Queens Anti-Gentrification Project and Reform Queens for Economic Justice. (Reminds me of the Syrian opposition groups, so fluid you never know who your enemy is.)

These folks seem to be against "everything," and everybody except Alexandria.



Offline abcdefghijk

  • Mayor
  • *******
  • Posts: 1702
    • View Profile
Re: Amazon HQ2 in LIC? Yay or Nay?
« Reply #74 on: November 16, 2018, 10:15:03 AM »
Don't use the g-word.

I am not a Hoover's FBI G-Man, but I suggest you tell Queens Neighborhood United not to use the g-word, as they are the ones who did.  Publicly on their posters. Or are Latinos allowed to use it and G's not allowed to use it? What about non Latinos and non G's, can they use it?

It's very confusing. I don't know what the rule is.

Plus I get different and contrary answers depending on who I ask about it!

Young folks don't seem to care.  Older people seem to be more sensitive.

« Last Edit: November 16, 2018, 10:30:06 AM by abcdefghijk »