Author Topic: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!  (Read 2611 times)

Offline pipman

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2021, 07:57:34 PM »
All this attention to 34th Avenue is ridiculous, yes let's not have dog poop on 34th Avenue so it piles up everywhere else in the neighborhood.  Have never heard anything from DOT or our local politicians on the impact this will have on neighboring streets when more opens up in the city and traffic increases.  What is the solution for the heavy metal barriers, many elderly, disabled folks can't get out of the car to move them if they need to park or reach their home.  Delivery trucks in the middle make it dangerous to cross, since they block the view if a motor delivery bike is coming down the street.  There are so many things that need to be addressed beyond having the elderly play bingo in the street.   

Offline jh35

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2021, 09:09:53 AM »
All this attention to 34th Avenue is ridiculous, yes let's not have dog poop on 34th Avenue so it piles up everywhere else in the neighborhood.  Have never heard anything from DOT or our local politicians on the impact this will have on neighboring streets when more opens up in the city and traffic increases.  What is the solution for the heavy metal barriers, many elderly, disabled folks can't get out of the car to move them if they need to park or reach their home.  Delivery trucks in the middle make it dangerous to cross, since they block the view if a motor delivery bike is coming down the street.  There are so many things that need to be addressed beyond having the elderly play bingo in the street.

I am against the open street on 34th avenue. Why did they pick the widest residential street that cuts through JH? Do people need 4 lanes to jog? It would have been more practical to close 35th avenue or, better, 37th avenue to traffic.

With 34th avenue closed to traffic, 35th avenue is now overcrowded. Trucks block the only lane. People honk horns at all hours. I have seen ambulances stuck in traffic. 

I am all for closing 37th avenue to traffic permanently with large areas on side streets left for trucks to temporarily park (technically, stand?) for unloading. As I have said before, we need parking structures. But, all available space is being used for new schools since the neighborhood is above its designed capacity.

If we had parking structures then some cross streets could be closed with bike lanes.

I am not against closed streets. I just want it done in an appropriate way. Not in a pie in the sky way, like demanding that the city buy a car dealership.

The superblock type idea would work here since we have a grid system. But, it would only work with adequate parking. 

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/barcelona-ban-cars-traffic-pollution_n_5dd6665ae4b0fc53f20e6bbd




Offline itsit

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2021, 12:25:16 PM »
 "I am against the open street on 34th avenue. Why did they pick the widest residential street that cuts through JH? Do people need 4 lanes to jog? It would have been more practical to close 35th avenue or, better, 37th avenue to traffic." quoted from jh35 in a previous post

  Open Streets needs to move to 37th Ave. Please RECONSIDER WHICH AVE WE CLOSE!
 
 Who in their right mind as a resident - or a city planner- would possibly close 34th Ave over the dire needs on 37th Ave if they cared about the community as a whole? Maybe a politician or someone who just wants an immediate fix without long term assessment?
   If Jackson Heights is a heart, the main working artery is 34th Avenue. It's a wide through street with lot's of room for pedestrians, a long standing successful bike lane and swift access for residents, businesses, service and emergency vehicles. It's not broke! But 37th Ave is broke. And the Open Streets program could create a terrific plaza situation which would be a wonderful boon to our commercial district which is in high need right now. We need to be directing traffic and resources to 37th Ave asap! There are restaurants, lot's of retail, seating, trash cans and so much more that was discusses as needing to be brought to 34th Ave. Why in world world would you be bringing amenities to one avenue in a neighborhood when they already exist on another two blocks away???
  Losing the assets of 34th Ave to a pedestrian mall looks very similar to me to the public cry for Green Space, Green Space, Green Space that has resulted in the shrinking grassy mound in Travers Park that replaced the play field our kids once had. The mound is unsustainable!! It looked great for a short time and people were happy but now that's over and upkeep is very costly. When the fence comes down for a few days, the Green Space goes to mud quickly from people who miss the play field. BUT the public was happy! And this is how the 34th Ave planning is going.
   The public may like hearing about the possibility of permanence but the MTA and DOT and other agencies think their best projects are small and incremental. They cite various areas of Broadway in Manhattan as public spaces that evolved slowly and with lots of changes, not a blanket sweep and overnight type of change as it being proposed on 34th Ave now. In fact, they would prefer quite the opposite if you have a longer conversation with them.
   I do believe we could have closures from time to time on some side streets for things like the Green Markets and school recess and summer fairs. But the 34th Ave closure is not a considered project at this time and we should record everyone's name who is promoting this so when it is a more of a tishstorm at full return to post Covid life, they will be held accountable. Save our 37th Ave commercial areas and turn them into viable plazas that benefit the whole JH community!!!

Offline abcdefghijk

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2021, 05:40:24 PM »
"I am against the open street on 34th avenue. Why did they pick the widest residential street that cuts through JH? Do people need 4 lanes to jog? It would have been more practical to close 35th avenue or, better, 37th avenue to traffic." quoted from jh35 in a previous post

  Open Streets needs to move to 37th Ave. Please RECONSIDER WHICH AVE WE CLOSE!
 
 Who in their right mind as a resident - or a city planner- would possibly close 34th Ave over the dire needs on 37th Ave if they cared about the community as a whole? Maybe a politician or someone who just wants an immediate fix without long term assessment?
   
  Losing the assets of 34th Ave to a pedestrian mall looks very similar to me to the public cry for Green Space, Green Space, Green Space that has resulted in the shrinking grassy mound in Travers Park that replaced the play field our kids once had. The mound is unsustainable!! It looked great for a short time and people were happy but now that's over and upkeep is very costly. When the fence comes down for a few days, the Green Space goes to mud quickly from people who miss the play field. BUT the public was happy!


I disagree. The Travers Park grassy mound is fantastic.

And yes, that's right... the public...that is, the majority...IS who counts in a democracy. Correct.

Otherwise the system is an oligarchy...ruled by a select few.

Offline CaptainFlannel

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2021, 06:54:02 AM »
Quote
I am against the open street on 34th avenue. Why did they pick the widest residential street that cuts through JH?

Because it leads to Travers Park

Quote
Do people need 4 lanes to jog?

It sounds like you have never seen 34th Avenue. When it is open to traffic, there is one lane of traffic heading east, and another lane of traffice heading west. (That's two lanes of traffic, the same as 35th and 37th Avenue). There is a median with trees and plants in the center (which may have factored in to why it was selected as an Open Street since it helps provide social distancing from people who typically stay to the right of the median, following normal traffic patterns, provides more shade and just makes it a nicer experience). There are parking spaces on both sides of the street, which people can use during the hours Open Streets are open as well as closed. So, no people don't have four lanes to jog down. They have two. The space is also used for kids to play hop scotch, learn to ride a bike, race, etc., as well as for adults to gather at a safe distance from their neighbors.

Quote
It would have been more practical to close 35th avenue or, better, 37th avenue to traffic.

I don't see how it's more practical since it's the exact same number of traffic lanes, neither street connects to Travers Park, and 37th Avenue is a business corirdor where deliveries need to be made. (Though being a driver who leaves pretty early most days, I do know many delivery trucks are making their deliveries at 6 am). I would encourage you to consider that others have different priorities than yourself, and that doesn't necessarily make those priorities (or yours) wrong, it just makes them different.

 
Quote
What is the solution for the heavy metal barriers, many elderly, disabled folks can't get out of the car to move them if they need to park or reach their home.  Delivery trucks in the middle make it dangerous to cross, since they block the view if a motor delivery bike is coming down the street.  There are so many things that need to be addressed beyond having the elderly play bingo in the street.

And that is exactly why you should have participated in the DOT workshops inviting residents to provide input on the final form of 34th Avenue Open Street, or did you actually think the way it is now is the way it's always going to be (and if so, why)? Did you participate in those community discussions, @pipman?

Offline Meowtron

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #20 on: February 27, 2021, 08:09:48 AM »
All this attention to 34th Avenue is ridiculous, yes let's not have dog poop on 34th Avenue so it piles up everywhere else in the neighborhood.  Have never heard anything from DOT or our local politicians on the impact this will have on neighboring streets when more opens up in the city and traffic increases.  What is the solution for the heavy metal barriers, many elderly, disabled folks can't get out of the car to move them if they need to park or reach their home.  Delivery trucks in the middle make it dangerous to cross, since they block the view if a motor delivery bike is coming down the street.  There are so many things that need to be addressed beyond having the elderly play bingo in the street.

And these questions can be addressed if there’s enough input from the community especially from the elderly/disabled community. While the weight of the barriers can be an issue, in your example, how are the elderly/disabled getting into the cars if they are not able to get out? How often is this an actual problem? Was parking right by your building consistently even possible anyways pre-pandemic? Or did people have to park elsewhere anyways. I am curious to know how much is perception versus fact. And what is common sense or not. I’ve never experienced having my vision blocked so much by delivery trucks that I can’t peer around them to see what is going on. But then, maybe that is just my perception.

Offline abcdefghijk

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #21 on: February 27, 2021, 08:47:21 AM »
All this attention to 34th Avenue is ridiculous, yes let's not have dog poop on 34th Avenue so it piles up everywhere else in the neighborhood.  Have never heard anything from DOT or our local politicians on the impact this will have on neighboring streets when more opens up in the city and traffic increases.  What is the solution for the heavy metal barriers, many elderly, disabled folks can't get out of the car to move them if they need to park or reach their home.  Delivery trucks in the middle make it dangerous to cross, since they block the view if a motor delivery bike is coming down the street.  There are so many things that need to be addressed beyond having the elderly play bingo in the street.

And these questions can be addressed if there’s enough input from the community especially from the elderly/disabled community. While the weight of the barriers can be an issue, in your example, how are the elderly/disabled getting into the cars if they are not able to get out? How often is this an actual problem? Was parking right by your building consistently even possible anyways pre-pandemic? Or did people have to park elsewhere anyways. I am curious to know how much is perception versus fact. And what is common sense or not. I’ve never experienced having my vision blocked so much by delivery trucks that I can’t peer around them to see what is going on. But then, maybe that is just my perception.

Often the approach is an example of "Virtue Signaling" being used for political lobbying power. It's blatantly obvious and is the trend these days.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2021, 08:53:02 AM by abcdefghijk »

Offline CaptainFlannel

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #22 on: February 27, 2021, 08:47:39 AM »
^^the final form of 34th Avenue Open Street is not its current form. I don't understand why people assume it is going to stay how it currently is, which BTW requires volunteers to move the barricades twice a day and is not a sustainable model. The input has been happening through DOT Zoom workshops. Have you participated in any?

Offline Meowtron

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #23 on: February 27, 2021, 10:06:47 AM »
^Definitely. When I mention input, I mean they should be addressing their concerns through these workshops. From there the DOT can decide what rationally needs to be addressed or what are just possibly only negative assumptions. (And yes, I have inputted feedback as to the benefits of the open streets and thoughts to any improvements that could be made).

Offline jh35

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #24 on: February 28, 2021, 10:23:02 AM »

Quote
Do people need 4 lanes to jog?

It sounds like you have never seen 34th Avenue. When it is open to traffic, there is one lane of traffic heading east, and another lane of traffice heading west. (That's two lanes of traffic, the same as 35th and 37th Avenue). There is a median with trees and plants in the center (which may have factored in to why it was selected as an Open Street since it helps provide social distancing from people who typically stay to the right of the median, following normal traffic patterns, provides more shade and just makes it a nicer experience). There are parking spaces on both sides of the street, which people can use during the hours Open Streets are open as well as closed. So, no people don't have four lanes to jog down. They have two. The space is also used for kids to play hop scotch, learn to ride a bike, race, etc., as well as for adults to gather at a safe distance from their neighbors.

That was weird. I have driven down 34th avenue quite a few times. It is wider than 35th avenue, so in my old mind, I remembered it was 2 lanes in each direction. It isn't pretty getting old.

Offline CaptainFlannel

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Re: Actually, 34th Ave Open Streets has not been decided. Zoom tonight 6:00!
« Reply #25 on: February 28, 2021, 11:50:11 AM »
^maybe you're thinking about the bike lanes? :)  That's also probably another reason 34th Ave was chosen.

Offline abcdefghijk

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“We’re ultimately trying to get equity on our streets. We built the city around the automobile to disastrous results,” said Transportation Alternatives Executive Director Danny Harris. “Our challenge for incoming leaders is to think about the incredible success in minor street transformations and scale that across the entire city.”

The vision, called “NYC 25 by 25,” has the backing of more than 80 organizations, including the 34th Avenue Open Streets Coalition, 89th Street Tenants Unidos Association in Jackson Heights, Bedford-Stuyvesant Restoration Corporation, Families for Safe Streets, La Colmena, Pakistani-American Youth Society, the Street Vendor Project at the Urban Justice Center, Tri-State Transportation Committee, and Bike NY.

And together, they’re asking mayoral candidates to reimagine 25 percent of the space currently allocated for vehicles — including 19,000 miles of travel lanes and three million on-street parking spaces — as public space within four years to create a healthier New York that puts people above cars, especially as the city recovers from the COVID-19 pandemic, a health crisis that shined a light on the city’s unequal access to transportation and green space.

--------------------------

The future is getting closer and closer. Reactionaries are swimming against the tide and will be on the wrong side of history.

Offline itsit

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 Less private cars on streets is a worthy goal over time. Class factors abound here. Many people who live further out in the boros most likely need their cars for work. Not sure how many Transportation Alternatives folks do? If you are living in a multigenerational household and working two jobs, bikes are a leisure activity maybe but not your main mode of transit. Until such time as when we have more real options to getting seniors, disabled folks, larger families and others not solo healthy riders, we truly need the streets and car access. But in time, with lots of input and planning by all parties including bike riders, but not exclusively them, we can have some parity in transit. Unfortunately, that time is not at hand and this could be seen as a punishment to those who have the least resources, transit-wise.

  Have you ever commuted to or from Southeast Queens? Often difficult by transit...

Offline abcdefghijk

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Less private cars on streets is a worthy goal over time. Class factors abound here. Many people who live further out in the boros most likely need their cars for work. Not sure how many Transportation Alternatives folks do? If you are living in a multigenerational household and working two jobs, bikes are a leisure activity maybe but not your main mode of transit. Until such time as when we have more real options to getting seniors, disabled folks, larger families and others not solo healthy riders, we truly need the streets and car access. But in time, with lots of input and planning by all parties including bike riders, but not exclusively them, we can have some parity in transit. Unfortunately, that time is not at hand and this could be seen as a punishment to those who have the least resources, transit-wise.

  Have you ever commuted to or from Southeast Queens? Often difficult by transit...

We are in the midst of a revolution. Telecommunicating has been proven viable by Zoom etc during the pandemic.
There will be less need for driving to work.
Hence cars will be far less necessary.
Such is the future.
Using pre pandemic ideas (as above) will become irrelevant.

A return to "village-like, local-type living" will be the trend. My prediction.
Private cars are OUT.
Uber/Zip cars etc will be in.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2021, 11:18:14 AM by abcdefghijk »

Offline itsit

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   We are in the midst of a revolution. Telecommunicating has been proven viable by Zoom etc during the pandemic.
There will be less need for driving to work.
Hence cars will be far less necessary.
Such is the future.
Using pre pandemic ideas (as above) will become irrelevant.

A return to "village-like, local-type living" will be the trend. My prediction.
Private cars are OUT.
Uber/Zip cars etc will be in.
[/quote]

  But unfortunately, as we have seen with the Covid19 vaccinations, the well connected internet users who were primarily white, were first, second and third in line. This is not equity and unfortunately, we have some distance to travel before certain populations are equally connected. Poorer schools even here in Queens are not seeing the same opportunities for their students regarding connectivity. Until then the private cars are necessary but as a means of getting to far flung employment and as a source of income for Uber drivers whose own families often can't afford to use the service. We need to be in the now but some of these ideas are great going forward and with extensive planning.